[Solaire] Énergie solaire photovoltaïque

[Lansing]

Merci, Greenchris, tu as bien fait de me reprendre, j'ai été trop vite je me suis gouré d'une décimale :
-HP: 0,0765€ HT
-HC: 0.0450€ HT
C'est ce qui apparaît sur ma facture, en TTC ça correspond. Du coup les 22cts d'euros me parraîssent presque attirants...

[macca2]

j'ai 15 m² de panneaux photovoltaiques sur mon toit . A mon avis c'est pas rentable . Je consomme ce que je produis et revend le reste à EDF.
Mais , certains jours , en pensant que la maison tourne uniquement au soleil , ça fait vraiment plaisir . Au moins mes enfants ne me diront pas , quand la catastrophe arrivera , mais papa tu savais qu'on allait droit au mur !

[coronado]

Bonjour a toi et bienvenue sur le forum.

Ce sujet est interessant,peux tu nous donner plus d'informations sur ton installation et developer un peu plus ta conclusion s'il te plait?

[greenchris]

Oui, pour avoir une rentabilité possible, il faut prendre l'option avec 2 compteurs, un pour l'installation photovoltaïque sur lequel tu revend 100% du courant solaire au prix de reprise.
Et un deuxiemme compteur normal que tu utilises pour ta consommation au prix normal d'EDF.

[energy_isere]

BP solar signe un accord avec une compagnie chinoise pour faire une joint venture et fabriquer + vendre des cellules photovoltaique + commercialiser des systémes photovoltaique en Chine :

http://www.iii.co.uk/news/?type=afxnews ... on=article

BEIJING (AFX) - BP Solar, a unit of the BP Group, said it has signed an agreement with China Xinjiang SunOasis Co to form a joint venture to manufacture, market and sell solar photovoltaic (PV) products and systems in China.

The joint venture has a registered capital of over 10 mln usd with SunOasis holding a 51-pct stake and BP a 49-pct stake.

The statement said that the joint venture will result in the creation of two companies, BP SunOasis Company Limited and BP SunOasis (Prime) Company Limited.

It added that the joint venture, based in Xian in central China, will have a 25 MW installed capacity.

The Chinese government is planning for its domestic solar PV market to reach to 400MW by 2010 and 10GW by 2020 from a 2005 base of 20MW.

"With strong support from BP Solar and SunOasis, a main focus of the joint venture will be providing access to sustainable power in remote rural areas throughout China, as well as the developing grid-connect market," the statement said.

[macca2]

Mes 15m² de panneaux photovoltaiques me permettent de couvrir les besoins de la maison en électricité . Il a bien sur fallu éliminer toutes les résistances électriques . Il faut savoir que le chauffage électrique est une abherration physique , source d'enormes gaspillages energétiques .
l'eau du lave vaisselle et du lave linge est chauffée par 5 m² de capteurs solaires .
La crise pétrolière a venir sera gravissime . nous essayons de faire quelque chose.
le plus dur étant de faire prendre conscience aux gens de la gravité de la situation .

[energy_isere]

Quelques programmes solaires en Californie.

Dont un d'un endroit (Coachella Valley) qui à 350 jours de soleil par an !

Energy program would make it pay to go solar


Energy program would make it pay to go solar
Plan would offer millions to those who want to save by tapping the sun

Benjamin Spillman
The Desert Sun
December 27, 2005

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
PALM SPRINGS - A multi-billion-dollar state energy program could help the Coachella Valley maximize one of its best assets - the sun.
The overall initiative would pump $3.2 billion into solar energy development in the state during the next 11 years and put panels on 1 million rooftops.

One resort has already taken advantage of the state's current $421 million program and could save about $100,000 annually.

"Our energy bills kept going up up, up, up and up. It was killing us," said Art Brigman, CEO of Club Trinidad, a Palm Springs timeshare resort that once counted the Rat Pack among its well-heeled clientele.

So Brigman led the charge to invest $1.4 million in an energy renovation that resulted in 670 new photo voltaic solar panels on the rooftop of the old club.

And with about 350 sunny days a year, he was well-positioned in the Coachella Valley.

"We've got the best climate in the world in the Coachella Valley for solar energy," said Les Nelson, spokesman for the California Solar Energy Industries Association.

One of the world's most productive solar-generating areas is in the desert outside Barstow, about 80 miles to the north.

"It is not a whole lot different between there and Palm Springs," Nelson said.


Rate increases since the California energy crisis had pushed gas and electric bills for Club Trinidad to nearly $150,000 annually, Brigman said.
When the solar panels and a solar-powered water heating system go online, utility costs could drop to $50,000 per year, he estimates.

The savings alone couldn't have paid for the initial investment, Brigman said. But subsidies in the form of a $400,000 rebate from the utility company eased the burden.

"That's part of the way I was able to pay for the system," Brigman said.

Solar cash has run out

But the money behind the subsidies is gone. The pool of cash that delivered $421 million through the Public Utilities Commission to big projects such as Club Trinidad's is dry.
Subsidies already have helped develop enough solar energy capacity to offset the demand of more than 30,000 homes on the state's strained power grid, Nelson said.

"It is being used faster than it is collected," he said.

A proposal to continue funding the program with utility bill surcharges goes before the commission in January.

Another component of the proposal would shift a program to provide rebates for smaller systems - like those on single-family homes - from the California Energy Commission to the PUC, Nelson said.

The proposal revives an essential component of Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger's bid to expand renewable energy use in California.

The governor's widely publicized "Million Solar Roofs" initiative had bipartisan support, but died in the Legislature this year after construction unions demanded high wages for solar panel installers.

The governor bypassed the Legislature by asking the commission to sponsor the initiative, which shares many provisions of the solar roofs program.

The new program would continue to collect funds through utility bills under the line item Public Purpose Programs. The incentives are designed to get smaller as rising prices for conventional energy and advancing renewable technology help solar power become economically viable on its own.

The long-term assurances will give the solar industry more stability to make investments in itself, Nelson said.

Critics have said the incentives subsidize production of today's expensive panels and don't encourage investment in research to make the technology more efficient.

Price still high for solar

Price is another barrier for local homeowners, even if the new incentives go into effect.
For example, a system for a typical 2,000-square-foot desert home could still cost the buyer well over $20,000.

It can take a decade to recoup the cost through electric bills, Nelson said. It could take even longer for part-time valley residents who wouldn't get maximum mileage from their systems when they are out of town.

Still, Mike Mohr, owner of a Corona-based solar panel-installing firm, said high energy prices are a big reason solar power is finally moving from the energy fringe to the spotlight, especially in sunny Southern California.

"I didn't think it was going to happen in my life. I've been doing this 30 years," said Mohr, whose company, Mohr Power Solar, installed the system for Club Trinidad.

Solar backers say insurance against future energy price spikes is a big incentive for consumers the same way a mortgage protects homeowners from rising rents for tenants.

Brigman says it's inevitable more people will follow the trend, whether they want to or not.

"Fossil fuels are going to run out," he said. "We are going to use them all up."

[energy_isere]

http://www.asahi.com/english/Herald-asa ... 00128.html

Mitsubishi Heavy powers up new solar-panel program

01/10/2006

The Asahi Shimbun


Mitsubishi Heavy Industries Ltd. plans to enter the solar power market on a major scale, based on a significant advance in its solar-cell technology and a growing demand for renewable energy sources.

Officials said over the weekend that the Tokyo-based company had developed solar panels that are 50 percent more efficient than its current models.

In 2004, Mitsubishi panels accounted for about 1 percent of the world's solar power capacity of around 1,200 megawatts. It now aims to supply 5 percent of the capacity within 10 years.

The boost in production will start as early as next year at a factory to be built in the compound of the company's Nagasaki shipyard, officials said.

Tens of billions of yen will be invested in the project, they added.

Mitsubishi researchers developed a thin membrane that can use a broader spectrum in the wavelength of solar light to generate electricity.

As a result, the efficiency rate for solar energy conversion was raised to 12 percent from the current model's 8 percent.

Mitsubishi officials also said that the cost for manufacturing the new solar panels will be about half that of rival companies.

For Mitsubishi to realize its plan to produce 5 percent of the world's solar power capacity within 10 years, the new factory will have to manufacture at least 300 megawatts of capacity a year. That amount of energy can supply the electricity for 100,000 households.

In 2004, Sharp Corp., based in Osaka, was the top manufacturer of solar panels, accounting for an estimated 27 percent of world capacity. It was followed by Kyocera Corp., based in Kyoto, with 9 percent.

Japanese companies account for more than 50 percent of solar power generating capacity installed worldwide.

If Mitsubishi begins full-scale production of new solar power systems, the share of Japanese companies in the world market is expected to increase.(IHT/Asahi: January 10,2006)

[energy_isere]

sur le site de Mitsubishi on trouve un endroit pour les cellules solaires, mais c'est assez "leger".

http://www.mhi.co.jp/power/e_a-si/index.html

[energy_isere]

Belle croissance en vue pour le photovoltaique :

[th]

Cela exposé, on peut se demander dans quel délais on trouvera sur le marché de telles cellules pour un cout deux fois moins cher que celle en Silicium. 5 ans ? 10 ans ?

Et surtout dans quel delais on en trouvera en grande quantité. Le cout en investissement est une contrainte majeure du dev. de tellee energiee.

Une question en passant ! C'est quoi des GWp ?
En comment on convertit ça en Tep ou en TWh / an, ou une autre unité de d'energie ?

[Schlumpf]

GWp veut dire - si je ne me trompe pas - Giga Watt Photovoltaïque. C'est donc une unité de puissance et non de production. Celle-ci dépend de l'ensolleillement. A partir de là on en déduit des GWh qui se transforment eux-mêmes en Tep (tonne équivalent pétrole). Bon calculs !

Quelques références sur le Wiki:

http://oleocene.org/wiki/index.php?titl ... 3%A9nergie

[th]

C'est donc une unité de puissance et non de production. Celle-ci dépend de l'ensolleillement. A partir de là on en déduit des GWh ...

Ca je le savait. C'est justemenent comment on calcule la production qui m'interesse.
Par exemple pour l'éolien il y la regle de 2 qui marche bien : on prend la puissance installée en MW, on multiplie par 2 et on a grosso modo la production en Twh / an.
Je cherche un truc equivalent pour les Wp.

[Schlumpf]

Pourquoi tu demandes si tu sais si bien...

Bon bref, la "loi" des "2" vient de la formule suivante:
MW x 365 (jours) x 24 (h) x 0,17 (rendement) = 1,5 GWh (pas TWh)

Pour le photovoltaïque, cela depend évidemment de l'ensolleillement:
MW x 365 x 9,5 (heures) x 1 (rendement) = +/- 3,5 GWh

Mais à nouveau, cela dépend de l'ensolleillement. Voici deux liens intéressants:

http://www.solargie.com/index.php?gid=53&sid=204
http://perso.wanadoo.fr/solaire2000/FAQ ... OLAIRE.htm

"Une installation photovoltaïque reliée au réseau EDF a une productivité d'environ 100 kWh/m².an, "

J'espère avoir répondu à ta question cette fois-ci !

[th]

J'espère avoir répondu à ta question cette fois-ci !

Pas tout a fait, car tu as introduit des m2 dont je me serai bien passé...
Je reprend la main, avec tes infos :
D'apres http://www.chelsfieldsolar.co.uk/Solar.htm , la "Power density " du PV classique est de 120 Wp/m2 " .

Comme 1 m2 produisent 100 kWh / an, on a 1 Wp => 100/120 = 0.83 KWh par ans.

Donc 5.4 GWp (production de panneaux en 2010) representent 5.4*0.83 = 4.5 TWh/an, si je ne me suis pas planté (il se fait tard...)

Soit pas grand chose, au niveau mondial....