[Pétrole] Sables bitumineux (du Canada)

[franck1968]

La production de sables bitumineux des réserves du nord de l'Alberta dépasse actuellement la barre du million de barils par jour, soit environ 5% de la consommation américaine. Mais avec les expansions en cours et des projets à venir d'une valeur de 100G$, cette production pourrait atteindre de trois à quatre millions de barils par jour d'ici les 10 ou 15 prochaines années, selon certaines prédictions.

lien

[echazare]

A parceque les USA vont envahir le Canada ?

[franck1968]

je ne comprends pas ta question.

[energy_isere]

veut il dire que le Canada ne pourra pas investir seul ces 100 milliards $ ?

De toute facon on a déja dit que le probléme ne se situe pas que la :

- il faut avoir la bonne main d' oeuvre qualifiée sur place (probléme déja actuel)
- il faut loger tous ces arrivant (probléme de logement, pas assez de construction)
- il faut les énormes engins dont la production n'arrive pas à suivre, en particulier les énormes pneumatiques.

[edit] - et comme le rapelle Greenchris, il faut du Gaz (pour le chauffage nécessaire à la séparation du pétrole visqueux du sable et de l'eau).

[greenchris]

Il faut du gaz

Le président russe a évoqué en particulier un important projet de transport de gaz naturel liquéfié par bateau à partir de Saint-Pétersbourg jusqu'à Gros Cacouna au Québec où il serait vendu sur les marchés nord-américains.

C'est pas beau toute cette industrie pétro-gazière qui affiche des rendements s'améliorant de jour en jour grace au génie technicien de l'homme
http://www.oleocene.org/phpBB2/viewtopi ... 3280#73280

[echazare]

veut il dire que le Canada ne pourra pas investir seul ces 100 milliards $ ?

De toute facon on a déja dit que le probléme ne se situe pas que la :

- il faut avoir la bonne main d' oeuvre qualifiée sur place (probléme déja actuel)
- il faut loger tous ces arrivant (probléme de logement, pas assez de construction)
- il faut les énormes engins dont la production n'arrive pas à suivre, en particulier les énormes pneumatiques.

[edit] - et comme le rapelle Greenchris, il faut du Gaz (pour le chauffage nécessaire à la séparation du pétrole visqueux du sable et de l'eau).

Et devinez quoi, il faut aussi du petrole conventionnel pour faire un mélange raffinable... (je ne trouve plus la source )

[franck1968]

Vous ne pensez pas que c'est possible donc 3 à 4 million de barils à partir des sables bitumineux d'ici 10 ou 15 ans ?

[echazare]

3Mb/j dans 15 ans peut être.... mais à cette date la demande sera 30% à 40% sup à aujourd'hui, je ne suis pas sur que cela soit suffisant. Par ailleur le Canada va pas faire comme l'AS, il va le garder son pétrole....

[greenchris]

Il y a aussi des besoins en eau et une pollution énorme de cette eau après utilisation qui sont aussi un facteur limitant important.

[echazare]

En effet, je crois d'ailleurs que les fleuves environnants commencent à avoir des soucis de débit...

[epe]

Vous ne pensez pas que c'est possible donc 3 à 4 million de barils à partir des sables bitumineux d'ici 10 ou 15 ans ?

Selon le très officiel Office national de l'énergie du Canada, le scenario de référence est de 3 Mb/j en 2015... et avoue que ce ne sera pas facile...

Il existe un scenario haut, à 4,4 Mb/j, si tous les projets annoncés se réalisent dans les temps et avec les résultats escomptés, mais c'est totalement irréaliste selon les mêmes.

Et un scenario bas à 1,9 Mb/j... si les prix du pétrole baissent!

[energy_isere]

Résumé en Francais :
La compagnie coréenne KNOC achéte des droits pour exploiter des sables bitumineux en Alberta et vise une production stabilisée de 30000 à 35000 barils par jours dés 2010 :

Korea Buys Canadian Oil Sands

South Korea signed a deal Monday to buy a 100 percent stake in an oil sands mine in Canada that can produce 250 million barrels of oil, Yonhap News Agency reported on Monday.
It said the estimated size of the Blackgold Mine in the Cold Lake region of Alberta will allow South Korea to extract 30,000-35,000 barrels of oil per day for the next 25 years.

Hwang Doo-yul, CEO of state-run Korea National Oil Corp. (KNOC), and Geoff Waterman, vice president of Newmont Mining of Canada, signed the deal in Seoul. The Canadian company is an affiliate of U.S.-based Newmont Mining Corp., the world's largest gold producer.

The South Korean firm is expected to begin production in 2008, with full-scale operations to commence two years later. KNOC paid $270 million for the mining rights and expects annual sales to reach $500 million once full-scale production commences.

Oil sands, also referred to as tar or bituminous sands, are deposits of bitmen trapped in a mixture of clay, sand and water. They are in essence sand or sandstone containing at least 10 percent petroleum.

There are estimated to be 175 billion barrels of petroleum that can be extracted from oil sands mines around the world, with Canada having the world's second-largest reserve of oil sands after Venezuela.

Canada, which has most of its oil sands mines in the Peace River, Cold Lake and Athabasca regions of Alberta, can churn out 4.7 billion barrels of oil on an annual basis.

The ministry said once production begins, the country's oil output self-sufficiency level could be raised by around 1.2 percent.

South Korea currently produces 115,000 barrels of oil daily from local and overseas oil fields.

Seoul wants to raise the self-sufficiency level from around 4 percent at present to 18 percent in 2013.

source : http://times.hankooki.com/lpage/biz/200 ... 311890.htm

[peleki]

Korea Buys Canadian Oil Sands
/.../
It said the estimated size of the Blackgold Mine in the Cold Lake region of Alberta will allow South Korea to extract 30,000-35,000 barrels of oil per day for the next 25 years.
/.../
The South Korean firm is expected to begin production in 2008, with full-scale operations to commence two years later. KNOC paid $270 million for the mining rights and expects annual sales to reach $500 million once full-scale production commences.

Ils tablent sur un baril entre $40 et $45 en 2010 donc.

C'est curieux que les canadiens vendent des droits d'exploitation alors que l'extraction des sables est très néfaste pour l'environnement. Les exploitants ne seront pas vraiment sensibles au problème. Les canadiens auraient tout intérêt à contrôler l'exploitation.

[energy_isere]

sur cette page http://www.centreinfo-energie.com/gener ... late=1,1,1 vous aurez une petite idée de comment on exploite les sables bitumineux au Canada.

[energy_isere]

il a déja été évoqué l' utilisation de l' energie nucléaire pour fournir de l' energie pour l' exploitation des oils sands au Canada. (parce que le Gaz n' aura qu' un temps .....)

C'est Machiavel qui vient au secours du diable diront certains .....

ca revient dans la presse, par exemple du 17 Aout 2006 :

Nuclear pitch for oil sands

DAVE EBNER

Globe and Mail Update

CALGARY — An upstart Alberta company, which includes oil patch heavy hitter Hank Swartout as a backer, has a deal with Atomic Energy of Canada Ltd. to market the Candu nuclear reactor to firms in Calgary looking to operate oil sands projects.

"Western Canada has to come to grips with atomic energy at some point in time. It's an extremely clean-burning fuel," said Mr. Swartout, chairman of Precision Drilling Trust and a partner in the recently formed Energy Alberta Corp., where he provides what he calls "quiet background help."

Energy Alberta, according to its lead partner, Calgary businessman Wayne Henuset, has a two-year exclusive deal with AECL to sell the Candu 6 reactor and the concept of nuclear power to oil companies.

Talks with six firms have already happened and a bigger push is now in the works, he said. Energy Alberta is targeting developers of projects that use steam injection to recover bitumen from the oil sands. That list is led by the likes of EnCana Corp., Husky Energy Inc. and Total SA of France.

Energy Alberta hopes to build a reactor worth about $3-billion by 2014 to provide steam to support the production of 220,000 barrels of bitumen a day.

Mr. Henuset said the company would own the facility and sell steam to several oil sands operators. He added that a poll the company conducted of 500 Albertans found only about a third of respondents opposed nuclear power.

"It's not something we're going to ram down throats, but it makes sense," Mr. Henuset said.

A draft of an internal AECL memo outlined the two-year agreement with Energy Alberta. Dennis Galange, an AECL vice-president, stated: "This will enhance our ability to foster the required Alberta government endorsement for Candu in the oil sands."

While Ontario is familiar with nuclear power, there was a distinct anti-nuclear sentiment among Alberta politicians up to last year, led by Premier Ralph Klein, who called it a last resort before shifting his view more recently.

"We have to consider nuclear power," Mr. Klein said in April.

The Sierra Club of Canada wants the issue debated publicly and believes it should be one of the main topics discussed in hearings the provincial government plans to hold to assess the future of the oil sands.

"AECL should be prepared to show up and say what they're up to," said Stephen Hazell, executive director of the Sierra Club, adding that because the federal government subsidizes AECL, it has an added obligation to engage in such talks.

Mr. Hazell also noted that Ontario still carries the burden of debt from investing in nuclear power projects that cost far more than expected, and he questioned the value of the Candu reactor, saying only one has been sold in Canada for years and the only recent buyers have been China and Romania.

An AECL spokesman said the firm has to finalize the partnership with Energy Alberta and wants to hone its strategic plan before making public statements.

The prospect of nuclear power in the oil sands has been raised quietly for the past several years after a 2003 study showed it to be economically viable, compared with using natural gas to generate power and steam.

Last year, Total said it would look at nuclear power. A company spokesman at the time said it would be "foolish" not to consider the option, adding that a team was investigating.

EnCana has said nuclear energy is among the potential options but hadn't considered it closely. Yesterday, a Husky spokeswoman said it would consider any fuel sources, but the company wasn't at that stage in its planning as yet.

Mr. Swartout said Energy Alberta knows the pace of selling nuclear power in Alberta will have to be slow.

"We have to be very cautious in how we approach people," he said. "The knowledge of atomic energy in Western Canada is at a very low level."

source : http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/ ... y/Business